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Fun
Shrewmkin wrote:
The only concern that would arise from it is, if Australia does legalise gay marriage, will gay married couples start demanding for tax exemptions for being a gay married couple, while straight married couples won't get such benefits, that is the only issue that I see from the whole thing.



...is this actually a thing at all?
Bain
Hey Shaun great post.

To the other belligerent, self absorbed twats on here that think your anti gay opinions matter. You are completely and uttery wrong.

Shrewm - once you've been out in society - read: grown up - for a bit and you have to fend for yourself, you'll realise that the shit you post on here was so stupid it's embarrassing.

Gays claiming tax breaks... lol
Hunterbob
Bain wrote:
Gays claiming tax breaks... lol

I had to have a chuckle at this. The only kind of tax breaks/benefits they will get will be the same ones that existing families get now (unless Abbott stays in power, then it'll be nothing).
Malieus
Does it matter? Fuck people act like these issues are so important, if people can get married or if women earn enough money, who fucking cares, don't be an asshole, and call someone out on being an asshole when you see it. I would hope people would do the same for me. Seriously who give a fuck if people can get married.
It is more the people getting killed for being what they are that shits me, the people starving while others eat themselves to death, while we fuck each other to the point when the planet can't support us. Stop making such a big deal about issues that ultimately don't fucking matter, and focus on the ones that if left run rampant will stop all the namby pamby hippy shit from being an issue again. Because you know a vast majority of us will be dead.
Neifelheim
So my question about Gay Marriage is this.

I have a friend that divorced from his first wife a number of years ago. They have 4 children with the eldest being about 16 and the youngest (twins) about 12. My friend has a well paying job but gets hit quite heavily for child support, as his ex-wife chooses not to work (she was a police officer) and is supported by her lesbian de-facto who has a well-paying job. So his ex is literally living the good life and my buddy is struggling.

If Gay marriage were recognized in Australia, will my friend be able to pay less maintenance because his ex is being supported by her spouse now? Because currently the legal system/child support system does not recognize this so my buddy feels like he is getting the short end of the stick.
Darkshaunz
Malieus wrote:
Does it matter? Fuck people act like these issues are so important, if people can get married or if women earn enough money, who fucking cares, don't be an asshole, and call someone out on being an asshole when you see it. I would hope people would do the same for me. Seriously who give a fuck if people can get married.
It is more the people getting killed for being what they are that shits me, the people starving while others eat themselves to death, while we fuck each other to the point when the planet can't support us. Stop making such a big deal about issues that ultimately don't fucking matter, and focus on the ones that if left run rampant will stop all the namby pamby hippy shit from being an issue again. Because you know a vast majority of us will be dead.


I see what you're saying, and I don't deny that in the grand scheme of things, same-sex marriage seems like it might want to take a backseat to say: i) solving world hunger, ii) achieving world peace and iii) building a sustainable future that doesn't take our planet into total catastrophe. You could go further to say that in the grand stage of the cosmos, the sum total of humanity's greatest achievements and failures amounts to nary a dot in the time-scale of the cosmos. Having a humbling perspective like that gives pause for us to appreciate the enormity of the universe we exist in, but it should never prevent us from thinking about ways to learn about things bigger than us.

However, to answer your question of: Does it matter? Yes, it does matter. Right now, we're not at the point where same-sex marriage is viewed as being a non-issue. There are schisms, deep cultural and religious ones where people view it as an attack on their faith and persons. This is a very primitive and irrational retaliatory response to something a great many people view as decent common sense, given the supposed state of modern technological advancement and progressive thinking.

The points about our world and all the troubles that come with our human presence are tremendous challenges. These are challenges that can only be solved by unilateral, multi-state and globally co-ordinated solutions. Energy, resource and commodity struggles and conflicts can be solved by a race of people that are mature and intelligent enough to come together to move humanity towards a more egalitarian and sustainable path. If we as a species, can't even agree on whether or not people of the same sex should be able to wed one another, we have virtually zero hope of solving those other world-reaching, culture-crossing and borderless problems that plague the precarious balance of nature and human advancement.

Let's start with the little things first, let's get those basic blocks of an evolved civilization into place. Then, when we've learned to look after our own species, can we realistically look to becoming the true custodians of the planet we call home. Until then, back to the drawing board we go.
cailo-
Why does it matter? Because if we can't solve the small problems how can we solve the big problems? Well said. *presses potm button*

Maybe on another tangent I wonder if popular science fiction has made people more complacent about the earth because they feel as if it is possible to make a warp engine and travel to another planet once we have ruined this one. I'm not saying it isn't possible, nobody can be sure of that, but people seem to think the earth is expendable. Yea lets prepare our selves by fixing the little issues, human kind has some big tests ahead.
Malieus
Darkshaunz wrote:
Let's start with the little things first, let's get those basic blocks of an evolved civilization into place. Then, when we've learned to look after our own species, can we realistically look to becoming the true custodians of the planet we call home. Until then, back to the drawing board we go.


What happens when we become so focused on the little things, that we miss the point of no return on the big things. Tell me one time, when it is practical to focus on the details before the larger substance. Building a House, it would be like place the light fitting before you have laid the foundation. Or putting icing on a rotten fruit cake, it may look like it is amazing because the small little details are great, but hey it still taste like shitty rotten fruit cake.

All you are doing is window dressing while the store burns down behind you.
Darkshaunz
Malieus wrote:
What happens when we become so focused on the little things, that we miss the point of no return on the big things. Tell me one time, when it is practical to focus on the details before the larger substance. Building a House, it would be like place the light fitting before you have laid the foundation. Or putting icing on a rotten fruit cake, it may look like it is amazing because the small little details are great, but hey it still taste like shitty rotten fruit cake.

All you are doing is window dressing while the store burns down behind you.


Amusing, here I thought you had something to discuss from another viewpoint. Looks like all you had was personal attacks and pointless analogies.

Let's just agree to disagree, then.
Malieus
Darkshaunz wrote:
Amusing, here I thought you had something to discuss from another viewpoint. Looks like all you had was personal attacks and pointless analogies.

Let's just agree to disagree, then.


Sorry, didn't mean it to come across as an attack. Just trying to show that as humans a lot of our most successful en devours depends more on a solid core rather than a little detail. That if that core is strong and good then the everything else kind of falls into place, over time. When it isn't sometimes you need to put in a lot of effort to strip it back and start again, essentially cut through all the excess.

I might have come across too strong. I deal with a lot of over the top political correctness in social circles, and it frustrates me to see people expend so much energy on small details, when they are just symptoms of larger over arching issues. That our inability as a species to empathize with others that don't share a similar view, values or skin colour is astounding. The reason for the analogies was more to attempt to express the futility in treating those symptoms instead of attacking the issues head on, at least where I am standing.
Fun
Malieus wrote:
I deal with a lot of over the top political correctness in social circles, and it frustrates me to see people expend so much energy on small details, when they are just symptoms of larger over arching issues.


It isn't a small issue though.

Being gay and having it illegal for you to marry your loved ones tells gay people they are of lesser value, that they are sub-human to their heterosexual counterparts. Have a look at the suicide rate for young gay males in Australia and the United States. Marriage equality isn't going to reverse that trend, but it goes a long way to fostering acceptance and tolerance - and should be a basic human right.

If you don't think fundamental equal civil rights for everyone is a big issue, then I pity you.
Hanlol
Couldn't have said it better myself Fun. I've always thought of legalising gay marriage as something that should never have been an issue in the first place. It's a basic human right to get married. Who gives a fuck what gender they are. All people should be treated equally in this.

The worst thing is, is that all of this effort that we're putting into this could be so easily solved if people just stopped fighting it. We're not talking about an issue where it's 50/50 and there are two equal sides.

People who think gay marriage shouldn't be legalised are just plain wrong.

I can't understand how people are still against it. We all know it's going to be legalised everywhere eventually, and everyone who fought so hard against it will, in the end, just look like a bunch of hate filled bigoted idiots.
Remedial
So before I say something bigotted I'm all for gay marriage, my sister is a giant bull dyke living with another giant bull dyke and right now if her girlfriend went into hospital and her family said my sister couldn't visit her then she wouldn't be allowed to visit, and that's pretty fucked up.

But out of curiosity with everyone saying it's a basic human right and everyone should be able to marry whoever they want, where do you actually draw the line on that? Would people support polygamy? incest marriages? downy marriages? and by downy marriages I mean someone that is so bad off that they couldn't legally sign any other contracts. Interspecies marriages?

I know this plays into the retarded argument of "if we let gays marry then why don't we let people marry dogs!?" which is a stupid argument, but where is the line?
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